The levels of delusion that people are able to achieve still astound me. The piece I wrote a bit back, How's that Gun Control Working Out for You? got linked at an online gamer's forum. Apparently one member there is virulently anti-gun. Well, someone found another thread at the site, and linked to the piece again - but here's the part of that thread - written by said anti-gunner - that inspired this post:
The UK has strict gun control and our last schoolyard shooting was Dunblane in 1996.So . . . draconian gun control has prevented another Dunblane or Port Arthur. OK, I can understand that reasoning, even if I disagree with it. It's the same logic that says the US invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq have prevented any more 9/11-like suicide attacks on U.S. soil.
Australia has strict gun control and their last spree shooting was Port Arthur - also in 1996. Both of those incidents were followed by the introduction of draconian legislation to stop such incidents completely. It would be absurd to claim that there will never be another such incident. But 23 years without a repeat indicates quite a high barrier to the aspirations of would-be spree killers.
I think it works like this:
(1) Make it very hard to buy unnecessary firearms.
(2) Offer amnesties to get the existing toxic pool of unnecessary firearms out of drawers and cupboards throughout the nation
(3) Now it is very hard for low-level housebreakers to pick up an untraceable gun
(4) Now there are very few gun-dealers, so the police can take time to investigate 'break-ins' by which their guns are passed to criminals.
(5) Now, there is a very restricted market for bullets - it's possible to trace the bullets used in a crime back to the shop and back to the purchaser. Arms dealers get more cautious about who they sell bullets to.
(6) Now its hard to shoot someone dead on impulse - so your murder rate is dropping
(7) and the chaotic, unstable criminals at the bottom of your society can't get a gun at all.
(8) You drop the insane, vindictive multi-lifetime jail sentences for crimes against property - so it makes logical sense for a thief to surrender instead of trying to kill all witnesses or die attempting to get away.
(9) So the more 'professional' criminals don't need guns for self-defense. And they don't want the extra jail time they get for carrying a lethal weapon.
Result: A low level of guns in your society and a low level of gun crime. It's not a zero crime rate. But about 8,000 fewer Americans will be shot dead each year.
Why do I think this would work ? Because, if you look at the top 25 developed nations, you'll see that it is the US of A which has an unhealthy love affair with hand guns. And a demonization of 'the criminals' who are given 99 year sentences which they don't have the life-span to serve.
And the US of A has three times the murder rate of those other developed nations. Doesn't look that mysterious an issue to me.
Correlation ≠ Causation, but I understand the idea.
Now, let's look at the rest of "Grungekitty's" assertions.
Hard for whom? For the law-abiding, obviously, since pretty much anything you want is available on the streets in the UK for the right price.
Yes, they've been doing that for quite a while now in the UK - a place where all legally possessed firearms have been registered with the government. However, a 2003 amnesty brought in a lot of weapons, but most everyone asked said that "it appears to have had little effect in the communities where it really matters." Another in 2004 brought in few firearms. In 2007 after a boy died after being shot with an air rifle, an amnesty in Wales brought in:
10 air rifles
4 air pistols
2 BB guns
1 blanks firing pistol and ammunition
1 hunting knife
1 imitation handgun
3 boxes of air gun pellets
And after each amnesty, gun crime increased.
Too right. Now they have to fence the stuff they steal and buy an untraceable gun! Or just rent one. There's apparently an active rent-a-gun business in the UK these days, for the down-on-his-luck criminal who can't afford the fifty quid necessary to purchase one.
No one knows how many guns are in circulation across Britain. Senior police sources confirm that they are 'easy and quick' to obtain. Whether they rent, borrow or buy, young men have no difficulty getting 'tooled up'. Semi-automatic pistols remain the weapon of choice, although Trident officers admit 'military hardware' has found its way onto the streets.That quote comes from a September, 2006 piece.
Oooh! "Break-ins" with scare quotes! From that same September report:
Elsewhere, thousands of AK-47s from east Europe are reported to have 'gone missing' in Britain. One senior police source admits halting the supply of weaponry into Britain remains a thankless task: 'We suspect a number enter the UK via lorry drivers using secret compartments. The issue is that we're concentrating on drug and human imports and yet bringing in a handful of guns is, relatively, dead easy.Who needs to break in to a gun shop? It's easier to smuggle in the stuff that legal gun dealers can't even handle - handguns, submachine guns, hand grenades, and assault rifles. The kind that actually have select-fire switches.
Really? And where do you get that idea? If it's easy to smuggle in weapons, ammunition is a snap. Your ignorance is showing, grungekitty!
And THIS is the one that leaves my jaw on the ground. The UK has done everything on this list, and their murder rate continues to INCREASE. I've done this comparison before, but here it is again - the ratio of homicide rates between the U.S. and Scotland, and the U.S. and England & Wales since 1946:
So the U.S. without all that "draconian gun control" has been experiencing a decline in homicide rates, while Scotland and England & Wales have had a slow but steady increase in their rates. If you project the slopes on out, you're looking at a 1:1 ratio about what, 2012?
But we're not done yet!
Riiiiight! Just like in the UK, WHICH IS AN ISLAND. I believe I've already addressed this bit of cranial flatulence.
Words fail me.
Words fail me still.
Give her credit, she's wrong about everything, and she finishes BIG!
Sorry, grungekitty, but we've seen the petri dish of the UK. We know what actually happens. The government succeeds in disarming the victim pool, and the criminals are emboldened. So not only does the homicide rate increase, but all other forms of violent crime go up too. After all, they're not afraid of the police, who - as crime victim Nikki Goeser explained, can't be everywhere all the time. No, the cops show up just in time to put out the crime scene tape and take photos of your loved ones. Not their fault. Protecting you and yours isn't really their job.
Sweet bleeding Shiva, the things people can convince themselves of in the face of all the evidence.